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User talk:Akuthia
Take a look at.. Young Bud for what i think is a cleaner, more concise, useful item template for TLR Um, lots of stuff (sorry, needed to sleep) Infobox Demo Aerial Insecta Feather I just put an info box there and changed the layout to how I was suggesting. As for the bestiary page, that is a category so, like you said, it just automatically pulls anything that is labelled bestiary, but there is no way to access the coding (that I've found). However, for the regular monsters and rare monsters pages - the links in the menu bar can be changed to link to the category and that page could be deleted as it's not really necessary. Andrealinia970 14:15, 31 January 2009 (UTC) ehm, take a look at Butterfly Family for what I''' think a family page should look like. Akuthia 18:44, 31 January 2009 (UTC) Butterfly page I really like that layout! It gives information on where to find the creatures as well as an indication of it being rare, common or boss from the colour of the row. I'm not sure what to do about the information on the location pages. I believe that needs to be reduced as there is way too much. However, I don't know if monsters drop certain items in specific places or if it's just generic. If it's generic then the families, drops, splits, and capture value can be taken off from those and just leave the name of the monster. If it's specific then maybe we could modify the monster's pages to say which items are dropped in a specific location and which are dropped everywhere. I came up with a new layout for a monster page that I would like your opinions on: Viscious Plant Another thing we could add to the family pages is possibly a list of items that ALL of those family members drop? Andrealinia970 18:56, 31 January 2009 (UTC) Here's what I think... the creature should be the base layer and should have ALL of the information there is on THAT creature. Everything Else points back to that creature. So lets say you're running around Mt. Vackle, and you see a monster that hasn't been listed at being there, instead of retyping everything for it, you merely point back to the monster, and add it to the known inhabitants list, or whatever. Same thing with items, need to know if something drops a specific item, list the monsters that drop it, grouped by area, so its easy to see that X monster types drop Y item in area A. EDIT: I also think that we should change the coloration if we go with this family template. i got it from what is already here, but the colors that it says, dont match up to what it looks like (at least to me) For instance, the color for birdwing looks to be purple, to me, but i got it from a listing of another rare mob... Akuthia 19:21, 31 January 2009 (UTC) Comment I don't quite understand what you're saying about the colour scheme... >_< As for the family and monster pages... I think I get what you're meaning... A monster page will have: capture value, locations, drops, splits and family type. Under the drops there will be an area subheading with a list of items it drops in that area. On the items page there will be a section where you list the families that drop or split into said item. On the families page there will be a list of monsters in that family which specify the location each monster can be found in. Yes? Andrealinia970 21:21, 31 January 2009 (UTC) Yep, except on an items page, it may be a mix of entire families, and specific monsters, since i think theres a chance only higher level ones may drop or split into certain things What i mean with the color scheme,is i think there is too much similarity between the "red" that is being used and a purple, which i dont think i've seen used yet. I think we need to choose a different set of three colors. Maybe no highlight, (plain white) for bosses (since that looks bland, and wouldnt present well with an area full of regular mobs and no bosses) to the blue in use now for rares, and maybe a green shade for regular mobs Akuthia 22:01, 31 January 2009 (UTC) ::Why would you want the rare to to be blue? I always thought rare when I saw red because it seems like a more forbidding colour, specifying that it's harder than a regular blue monster. As for a link to where the purple is used: Treant Family though I could easily understand that being changed. For now it might be better just leaving the item pages to list families rather than specific monsters - at least until we find an item that is definitely not dropped by any other family member. Andrealinia970 22:27, 31 January 2009 (UTC) Drops I'm fairly certain that drops vary with area and BR, although I can't see the exact mechanics of it. Unless we find out otherwise, I'm not comfortable taking out this specific information. There are plenty of items that are dropped by some family members but not others - for example, Large Donda Talon is dropped by Donda but no other Imps. So either the relevant item page will need to have specific monster types, or that information will have to go in the family page, which is something I thought we were trying to get away from. Nice picture, by the way! Ferret37 22:42, 31 January 2009 (UTC) well for one, order of toughness, since EQ came out with color con, has been white Monster and item pages should definitely be where all the information on that monster or item is located. Family pages don't need this. While I personally like having drops and splits on the location page, they are not really necessary and the page could be made much more accessible by trimming down excess data. And yeah, yello/orange works for me too. Ferret37 23:08, 31 January 2009 (UTC) Monster templates I've created three different coloured templates for the three types: Template:Infobox boss, Template:Infobox rare and Template:Infobox monster. I'm not sure if they need to hold any more information, but if you think they do just add it in (or tell me and I'll put it in if you're not sure how!)) Andrealinia970 23:10, 31 January 2009 (UTC) is this how you imagine it looking? Diatryma I think there is too much blank space if you format it with the infobox above the table Akuthia 23:31, 31 January 2009 (UTC) No, more like this? Added a HP line for rare infobox. Eye of Damnation Ferret37 23:52, 31 January 2009 (UTC) I hate to say it, but that's STILL alot of empty white space, imo. I hate having to scroll needlessly, and in this case, i tihnk thats what im doing, but maybe it will grow on me... now to see if i can duplicate it Akuthia 00:12, 1 February 2009 (UTC) well I think i got it, but i guess the art student in me just hates all that blank space.... Akuthia 00:19, 1 February 2009 (UTC) HP Is there any point in having HP? I've noticed that it's really really hard to actually figure out how much damage you've done unless you're very good at adding figures quickly. It's also more of an estimation than an actual figure since HP doesn't feature much enemy wise (ie, a group with 5 spiders in will have more HP than one with 4 so we'd have to have the HP for one spider which may confuse users) Just my opinion... your thoughts welcome! Andrealinia970 00:34, 1 February 2009 (UTC) HP For individual, regular mobs, you are correct, however, it can be useful for boss mobs, which is what he added it to. Theres only going to be one boss mob in a unit, the only thing im not sure of, is whether or not it's going to scale with BR, making it relatively pointless anyways Akuthia 00:37, 1 February 2009 (UTC) HP again No, there's no point in having it for regular monsters. It's useful for rare and bosses (more useful for rare, as it can give you some idea if you're completely outclassed). I'm certain it doesn't scale with BR, which is why some rares are practically impossible early on but a walk in the park later. As for accuracy, the way I get the number is to save before starting a fight and write down the damage that each union does each turn. Once the monster is at critical, I switch to weak attacks. Reload and repeat four or five times. This gives an accuracy of +/-1000HP (sometimes better). Blank space... yes, I agree, it looks a little bare. A possible solution would be to put drops, splits and arts back into a table, but to the left of the infobox instead of above it. I have to go to work now, but if I get a chance I'll see if I can knock up an example at lunch time. Ferret37 09:37, 1 February 2009 (UTC) Blank Space? I'm kind of confused... what do you mean blank space? I can't see any personally.... if you're just going on about the bare factor in general then that is easily remedied by finding more information to add! Andrealinia970 12:12, 1 February 2009 (UTC) what im referring to is all of the space between the links (like drops) and the info box to the right. Akuthia 12:52, 1 February 2009 (UTC) :: OH! I solved this by putting drops and splits into a table. See Charybdis and Dagon Andrealinia970 12:54, 1 February 2009 (UTC) mmmm those do look so very, very prettah :D i think we should start using that as the default template for monsters. Akuthia 14:17, 1 February 2009 (UTC) I decided to restart... So im goin to try and do as much fact checking as i can, and change pages as appropriate. One thing i'd like to do as well, is change all weapons to use an infobox (if i can figure out how to create one) and change them as i find things in stores etc.Akuthia 17:32, 1 February 2009 (UTC) damn it! i ALMOST had a complete template done for weapons, and my laptop got too warm and crashed... le aigh, atleast now i have an idea of what i am doing Akuthia 18:38, 1 February 2009 (UTC) Weapon Template If you need any help with it let me know! I designed the character infoboxes so if you want any help on creating multiple columns or so forth just say so or peek at those! As for a new proposition: Some information needs to be taken away from the location pages. I don't think we need the full stats on the weapons there... How about just the name of the weapon and the type of weapon along with the price? Andrealinia970 19:19, 1 February 2009 (UTC) i think i almost have it! I might have to rename my template again though, but on further review i think im gonna put a couple of tables in there so we'll seeAkuthia 19:37, 1 February 2009 (UTC) Monster templates I'm almost happy now. I'd still like to see enemy arts in the table, but this would have to be done slightly differently depending on category. I've edited Charybdis and Eye of Damnation to show what I mean - a regular monster has more drops than arts, so arts slips in under splits while a rare is likely to have more arts than drops. Comments? Ferret37 20:10, 1 February 2009 (UTC) :: I like much so! I think we have nearly have a standard layout for monsters! Just one thing I want to get cleared up, in the infoboxes there's space for an image. Do you think we should try to get a picture of each individual monster or have one standard picture for the Amoeba family and another for the Beetle family etc. and just have individual pictures for the rare and boss monsters? (or just the boss monsters) Andrealinia970 20:27, 1 February 2009 (UTC) :::: I think we're going to have trouble finding images of every single creature. Also, there's not much point, as aside from a couple of minor colour changes every creature in a family looks identical, even the rares. So, I think one standard pic per family and individual pics for bosses. :::: There's even more trouble in store if we don't take the pictures out of the infoboxes for items and weapons... ::::Ferret37 20:35, 1 February 2009 (UTC) :::::: I agree, I think the images need to come out of the item and weapon infoboxes as they're not really needed. A sword is a sword and pretty standard at that. I have a few boss images that I found elsewhere on the net >_< I'll add others as I find them, at least until I find away to get them out of the book or from the game... Sometimes I hate not having a scanner or camera >_< Andrealinia970 20:41, 1 February 2009 (UTC) its done! Template:infobox Weapon i just wish i could get some color boxes or something with that additional info EDIT removed picture tab from it Akuthia 20:42, 1 February 2009 (UTC) :: Very nice! The only change I would make is to respell disassembly (to what I just spelt it) Andrealinia970 21:03, 1 February 2009 (UTC) firefox is saying that disassembly is an incorrect spelling, i think it is supposed to be hyphenated. Akuthia 21:07, 1 February 2009 (UTC) :: I'll go along with "very nice" there. And "disassembly" is correct. Are we going to deal with weapon creation and upgrade on the weapon pages? Seems like a sensible place to put it. If so, it'll need a small section added for what it upgrades from (if applicable) and another for what to, and what components are needed.Ferret37 21:10, 1 February 2009 (UTC) dag nab it! i knew there was a reason i had so much space! ::lol. Look on the bright side, at least you do have the space...Ferret37 21:41, 1 February 2009 (UTC) Location layout. Right, I've been looking at getting rid of all the excess junk on the location pages, and (so far) I have this: Fornstrand. As far as information goes, have I taken out anything I shouldn't have? As far as layout and presentation go, I'm happy with the bestiary, having used the family template, but I suspect I can do better with the points of interest. Still messing around. Your thoughts please, good people? Ferret37 21:51, 1 February 2009 (UTC) looks good, wish i could see what it actually looked like before, as opposed to just the history list Akuthia 22:12, 1 February 2009 (UTC) ::Go to the history and compare the pages. Click on the link at the top to view the older one, and it now has a link (at the top again) which will allow you to switch from one to the other with a single click. Or open it in a new window or tab.Ferret37 22:17, 1 February 2009 (UTC) looks really good, i've almost got the weapons done.. dang i thought this was gonna be an hours worth of work, its taken me all afternoon lol Akuthia 22:37, 1 February 2009 (UTC) weapon template ok so did i do anything wrong with Template:infobox Weapon? I can't figure out where that line is coming from under "upgrades to" can one of you take a look and see if i did something wrong with it? Akuthia ::Took me a while to see, but you've taken the heading style back up a level ( Upgrades To instead of Upgrades To ). I haven't corrected it, it's not polite to edit a work in progress... Ferret37 23:47, 1 February 2009 (UTC) ah, thanks! but i wouldnt have minded, if we follow that though, nothing would ever get edited by anyone else, since a wiki is, sort of by defination, a work in progress :D but thanks for pointing it out. anything you'd like to see changed with it? Akuthia :: Yeah, true, but there's a big difference between an entire wiki (work in progress by a lot of people over a lot of time) and a template (work in progress by one person over a few hours). ::The only changes I'd suggest (apart from adding the "Upgrades From" line) are minor layout issues. For example, I'd put Special Effects into the infobox and drop the Notes sub-heading to the bottom. And possibly a lighter shade of green? It's quite hard to read. And formatting the two tables consistently. ::Like I said, minor details, I'm sure you have it under control. ::Ferret37 00:15, 2 February 2009 (UTC) Side point on location layout I don't think there's any need to list the family that each monster belongs to. I think a separation of headers into 'Boss', 'Rare' and 'Regular' would be enough as you can visit the monster's page to see it's family and to the family page to see what monsters are in that family. Andrealinia970 00:35, 2 February 2009 (UTC) ::Yes, you're right. I'll have a look at that soon, working on something else right now. Ferret37 01:21, 2 February 2009 (UTC) table size i cant seem to figure out how to change it, they're both at the same size the only thing i can think og thats doing it is style="border-collapse:collapse;" but i dont know what the negative to the line is, and the default seems to be collapsible Akuthia ::Hmm, I'd have stayed away from the collapse style unless I actually wanted cells to collapse. I'm sorry, I can never get my head around other people's code so I re-wrote the tables. Since you don't mind me stepping in! Like this. Template:Infobox_Weapon/doc. Ferret37 02:27, 2 February 2009 (UTC) Location template at the bottom of location pages. Hmm. I started this before I thought about trimming down the pages (usual page, Fornstrand). Back when it was a long haul up to the top of the page to the sidebar menu, this might have been useful. Not so sure it is with the proposed new location page layout.Ferret37 02:44, 2 February 2009 (UTC) :: I don't think it's needed with the trimmed down page. Merthos 08:10, 2 February 2009 (UTC) :::: I know, I guess I just wanted someone to tell me to keep it. How about the condensed version?Ferret37 15:06, 2 February 2009 (UTC) :::::: You have the category links so you can reach everything with just a click more. But I don't mind the smaller version. Leave it there when you like it. ;-) Merthos 16:11, 2 February 2009 (UTC) not a problem. i think i got it from the help files, but they obviously werent really helpful. thanks a bunch for making it look better.Akuthia Points of Comment I don't think we need one location box quite that big. Perhaps a smaller one for each location type. For example, the outdoor locations could have the other outdoor locations listed at the bottom. I just think that particular box is too big. Also, Can we edit the point of interests table in a similar way to what we had before with three subheadings: "Treasure Chest", "Excavation Point", and "Harvest Point" because I'm finding quite difficult to tell which are the harvest points. I don't think it's really important if it's a digging or diving location as it's still just a harvest point. Finally, I like the weapon template page but, with regards to the disassembly and upgrade tables, can we either make them without a background and border (like I created for the monster pages) or at least have a much paler background as the current ones really hurt my eyes when looking at it... Plus that "vital stats" could be deleted and the gap between the header and the subtitle too. Since there's not going to be an image we don't need room for it. Just a few thoughts. Andrealinia970 11:38, 2 February 2009 (UTC) ::Like this? Fornstrand Ferret37 14:00, 2 February 2009 (UTC) do you like those colors better? As far as the border is concerned, i really think it needs to be there since it's only going to be a single line of text. its fine if you've got long lists of things, but in this case, i think it just makes it look more pleasing on the eye. Akuthia 15:14, 2 February 2009 (UTC) Shields do you think we need a different coloration on the shields? Akuthia 02:12, 3 February 2009 (UTC) Weapon pages I've made some minor layout changes to your weapons page here: Daimyo Otachi. I've tried to take away headlines for emphasis as that would lead to an unnecessary contents box with some weapons. The code is ugly, but I'm really tired and can't think straight. What do you think? I reckon a little less bold text, but right now I'm going to bed... Ferret37 02:20, 3 February 2009 (UTC) I like it, especially the centering, but i still think i like the newest set of colors i used for the upgrades. What can i say, im a sucker for making things look nice. So i think i'll stick with your chances, except the color change for now, and try to work on a bunch of the items for right now. I'm going to see if i can make a regular template with the info box, to include EVERYTHING we're using. it might break something but hopefully not. if it doesnt, than any changes we make in the future should be able to be done through this one template, or the template box depending on what needs changed and it should be wiki wide.Akuthia 02:32, 3 February 2009 (UTC) You can use " " to hide the ToC for the given article and still use headlines. Merthos 08:36, 3 February 2009 (UTC) ::I like that page, I'm just going to have a quick play round to see kind of show you what I've had in mind. I guess I'm still not convinced that we need the disassembly items and such in tables with a background. I think it still throws too much colour at you at once.... '''Edit: I changed the layout a little, have a look and see what you think? Andrealinia970 09:46, 3 February 2009 (UTC) Wow, it seems like we're going to go around and around on this regarding color?plain white on white is very boring, and very amateurish looking to me. Personally, i'd rather have a nice, dark background and white text or some other color that will stand oout but not be obnoxious, but there needs to be some color other than straight black and white. Also, i think i like ferret's layout a bit better, everything just looks tighter and better aligned. EDIT:removed some of the jabberAkuthia 03:03, 4 February 2009 (UTC) hey, sorry i havent been working on this much.. been sick,, and actually playing the game, (still not done with my first play true play through :D once i beat it though, i definitely will pick back up on this